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Post by petey62 on Sept 4, 2020 10:19:23 GMT -5
Fierce, I said why I was disappointed. When you're up in a critical game 3, with HALF A SECOND to go, it's demoralizing to lose.
THAT'S WHY I'M DISAPPOINTED because I know how tough Toronto is.
We didn't finish.
I believe this will be a tough enough series, but I don't want us to GIVE THEM games.
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Post by Cabutan on Sept 4, 2020 10:20:30 GMT -5
well technically, any player can have a bad game you are right. I think we needed more of him yesterday to win. Even if we got a bit more from smart we would have won. But Tatum was not aggressive yesterday I agree. But Tatum was not the reason we lost. The coach made the wrong call. Also, let's not forget Tatum is just 22 years old. It's not like he's a 30-year old veteran. it was a weird game. I thought toronto came to fight. We came to be friends. Hate that but thats what happened
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Post by Cabutan on Sept 4, 2020 10:20:59 GMT -5
And no. It wasnt Tatums fault
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Post by petey62 on Sept 4, 2020 10:23:31 GMT -5
Oh stop with the age thing, Fierce. Let's wait till he's 28, huh?
Sorry dude, but Tatum is our leader.
Kemba said how refreshing it was for the Celtics to win an important playoff game with him being off his game. Kemba can say that because Kemba isn't our leader. Kemba isn't used to that.
Tatum doesn't have the luxury of taking that approach when you are THE MAN. That just comes with the territory REGARDLESS OF HIS AGE.
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:23:37 GMT -5
I agree. But Tatum was not the reason we lost. The coach made the wrong call. Also, let's not forget Tatum is just 22 years old. It's not like he's a 30-year old veteran. it was a weird game. I thought toronto came to fight. We came to be friends. Hate that but thats what happened The good thing is Jaylen is now upset and angry about the loss. This is a wake up call for the Cs. It will better prepare them for the next round.
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:26:10 GMT -5
Oh stop with the age thing, Fierce. Let's wait till he's 28, huh? Sorry dude, but Tatum is our leader. Kemba said how refreshing it was for the Celtics to win an important playoff game with him being off his game. Kemba can say that because Kemba isn't our leader. Kemba isn't used to that. Tatum doesn't have the luxury of taking that approach when you are THE MAN. That just comes with the territory REGARDLESS OF HIS AGE. Smart is the leader of this Celtics team. And no, Pete, only Celtic fans like me is calling Tatum THE MAN, the rest of the world is not yet convinced.
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:27:01 GMT -5
Last night was truly disappointing. When you're a HALF A SECOND from taking a commanding 3-0 series lead, AND YOU DON'T FINISH, that's just demoralizing. But Toronto is the defending champs. WE are going to have to take them out. If they didn't fold down 2 games to none and losing game 3 with a half a second to go, then believe me it's going to take everything from everybody to dispose of Toronto. And, for me, it starts with Tatum. He should NEVER have a 15 point night IN A PLAYOFF GAME. No, I don't need Herculean efforts like Donovan Mitchell and Jamal Murray gave in their first round series (BTW, Murray scored only 12 in game 1 vs LAC). But for this team to be successful, TATUm has to lead. Kemba was a beast, Brown played well with 19 pts and 12 reb, but Tatum CANNOT have a bad game.I don't know if he was ill or injured because at one point, it looked like he was shaking his head (like he had cobwebs). Nevertheless, he will have to consistently lead this team. At this point, even with the weapons on this team, no bad nights are allowed for Tatum. Kemba has a bad night and we can pull out a win. Tatum has a crappy night, our chances of losing are much higher. I sure hope this team comes out tomorrow and leaves no doubt about their resilience and determination to win this series. That's just ridiculous. Even Lebron and Kobe had bad games in the playoffs in the past. Saying that Tatum CANNOT have a bad game is UNREALISTIC! As somebody who likes you - please try to watch your tone a bit. Petey hasnt been around much this series - and he adds so much to this board. You can make your point without being so fierce (pun intended)
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:29:41 GMT -5
Just remember the last time you questioned Tatum's greatness, Pete.
Toby Harris got hurt badly.
What makes Jayson Tatum great is doesn't get too high or too low emotionally.
JT just bounces back after a bad game, just like he bounced back after that horrible first game in the bubble against the Bucks.
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Post by petey62 on Sept 4, 2020 10:29:49 GMT -5
Oh stop with the age thing, Fierce. Let's wait till he's 28, huh? Sorry dude, but Tatum is our leader. Kemba said how refreshing it was for the Celtics to win an important playoff game with him being off his game. Kemba can say that because Kemba isn't our leader. Kemba isn't used to that. Tatum doesn't have the luxury of taking that approach when you are THE MAN. That just comes with the territory REGARDLESS OF HIS AGE. Smart is the leader of this Celtics team. And no, Pete, only Celtic fans like me is calling Tatum THE MAN, the rest of the world is not yet convinced. Come on Fierce, Smart is the "Heart" of this team. Tatum is the "Leader" of this team and his age is irrelevant. These guys have had playoff battles for 3 years now with Lebron, Giannis, Embiid. They're tested, battle tested.
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:30:55 GMT -5
That's just ridiculous. Even Lebron and Kobe had bad games in the playoffs in the past. Saying that Tatum CANNOT have a bad game is UNREALISTIC! As somebody who likes you - please try to watch your tone a bit. Petey hasnt been around much this series - and he adds so much to this board. You can make your point without being so fierce (pun intended) He's the one who said I don't know what I'm talking about. I didn't start this.
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Post by petey62 on Sept 4, 2020 10:32:39 GMT -5
Fierce, by the way, life has a way of pre-empting some things you'd like to do...........like argue with you on this board.
When life doesn't allow for that, you won't see me on here, regardless of your feelings about me, brother.
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:33:04 GMT -5
Smart is the leader of this Celtics team. And no, Pete, only Celtic fans like me is calling Tatum THE MAN, the rest of the world is not yet convinced. Come on Fierce, Smart is the "Heart" of this team. Tatum is the "Leader" of this team and his age is irrelevant. These guys have had playoff battles for 3 years now with Lebron, Giannis, Embiid. They're tested, battle tested. Again, just remember the last time you questioned Tatum's abilities. Just ask Toby Harris how painful it was.
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:33:23 GMT -5
Fierce, Kobe's worst game was sixteen years ago against a Pistons team that was clearly better than the Lakers. And Kobe's other horrible performance was when he scored 1 point in the 2nd half against the Suns as a protest, taking only 3 shots. In the post game he fumed that everybody has to contribute and he couldn't do it alone. As for Lebron, his horrible games cane against much-superior opposition in the Spurs (2007) and Celtics (2008) and even a better Mavs team (2011). There is no reason for Tatum to have a game like last night against far-inferior opposition. When you're THE MAN, you will have to take the criticism that comes with not showing up in a critical semi-finals game 3. That's not what you said before the series started. You said this is going to be a tough series most likely going 7 games. Now you're saying Toronto is a far-inferior opposition? Name one player in the history of the NBA that didn't have one single bad game in the playoffs. The reason the Celts lost was because of the coach. Tatum was having a bad game, but Kemba made up for it. That's why the Celts were leading by 2 points with 00.5 left in regulation. All the Celts had to do was play straight up man to man defense and this series would've been 3-0. A basketball team never loses a game because of one reason. Its always a combination of reasons - 1. Lowry came roaring back from his slump 2. Brad made some questionable decisions (not just on the last play) 3. Tatum was inefficient 4. OG has been red hot this entire series 5. Toronto is a very good team
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:36:42 GMT -5
That's not what you said before the series started. You said this is going to be a tough series most likely going 7 games. Now you're saying Toronto is a far-inferior opposition? Name one player in the history of the NBA that didn't have one single bad game in the playoffs. The reason the Celts lost was because of the coach. Tatum was having a bad game, but Kemba made up for it. That's why the Celts were leading by 2 points with 00.5 left in regulation. All the Celts had to do was play straight up man to man defense and this series would've been 3-0. A basketball team never loses a game because of one reason. Its always a combination of reasons - 1. Lowry came roaring back from his slump 2. Brad made some questionable decisions (not just on the last play) 3. Tatum was inefficient 4. OG has been red hot this entire series 5. Toronto is a very good team Yes, I agree with #1 to #5. But it was down to one play. All the coach had to do was play straight up man to man defense. This would've been 3-0 if the coach made the right call.
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:37:22 GMT -5
Although Anunoby's shot at the buzzer gave Toronto the win, the Celtics crapped that game away long before that shot. There is no doubt that every Raptors player should have had a Celtics player guarding him during the inbounds. All the Celtics had to do was be in the vicinity of a Raptors player to contest the inbounds pass. That's all, if we're near a player, he likely doesn't have the freedom to easily catch and shoot uninhibited. Our defense abandoned us in the 3rd and 4th quarters, especially in the 3rd. Tatum wasn't why we lost but we win easily with any kind of consistent offensive performance that we've been getting from him in this playoffs. Again, we didn't lose because of Tatum, but we win if he leads.Too much to put on the shoulders of a 22-year old. Maybe in a couple of seasons you can put that kind of load on JT, but right now he's still very young and his body is not yet fully developed. Of course. Yes, we are putting too much on teh shoulders of a 22 year old. But if we want to win a championship - Tatum cant play like a 22 year old. Its not exactly fair to him, but if you want our championship window to start now (and not 2 years from now) Tatum needs to play beyond his years. I once hired a 23 year old, and I would consistently tell her "You are acting like a 23 year old!" And she would say "I am 23!" and I said, "no excuse".
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:39:12 GMT -5
Fierce, I said why I was disappointed. When you're up in a critical game 3, with HALF A SECOND to go, it's demoralizing to lose. THAT'S WHY I'M DISAPPOINTED because I know how tough Toronto is. We didn't finish. I believe this will be a tough enough series, but I don't want us to GIVE THEM games. Im with you. Gotta win next game now. If we had won, we'd be looking to close em-out. Now we find ourselves in a series with a good team. If you have a good team down, you gotta finish em off - cant let em hang around/come back. We've seen this in sports many times.
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Post by petey62 on Sept 4, 2020 10:40:19 GMT -5
That's not what you said before the series started. You said this is going to be a tough series most likely going 7 games. Now you're saying Toronto is a far-inferior opposition? Name one player in the history of the NBA that didn't have one single bad game in the playoffs. The reason the Celts lost was because of the coach. Tatum was having a bad game, but Kemba made up for it. That's why the Celts were leading by 2 points with 00.5 left in regulation. All the Celts had to do was play straight up man to man defense and this series would've been 3-0. A basketball team never loses a game because of one reason. Its always a combination of reasons - 1. Lowry came roaring back from his slump 2. Brad made some questionable decisions (not just on the last play) 3. Tatum was inefficient 4. OG has been red hot this entire series 5. Toronto is a very good team Drewski, all very good, and numbers 2 and 3 are in the Celtic's control. There was a run in the 3rd period where it seemed we just didn't have a fluid group on the floor and I wondered why BS didn't change the lineup as Toronto made a run. If Tatum scores 23, I honestly believe every number on your list becomes MOOT. Could be wrong but i truly believe that.,
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:40:36 GMT -5
Too much to put on the shoulders of a 22-year old. Maybe in a couple of seasons you can put that kind of load on JT, but right now he's still very young and his body is not yet fully developed. Of course. Yes, we are putting too much on teh shoulders of a 22 year old. But if we want to win a championship - Tatum cant play like a 22 year old. Its not exactly fair to him, but if you want our championship window to start now (and not 2 years from now) Tatum needs to play beyond his years. I once hired a 23 year old, and I would consistently tell her "You are acting like a 23 year old!" And she would say "I am 23!" and I said, "no excuse". The reason the Celtics will win a championship is because they have multiple star players. Tatum is just one of them. This Celtics team doesn't rely on one player to win games.
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:40:45 GMT -5
it was a weird game. I thought toronto came to fight. We came to be friends. Hate that but thats what happened The good thing is Jaylen is now upset and angry about the loss. This is a wake up call for the Cs. It will better prepare them for the next round. Agreed. I think Tatum and JB will be better in the long run from the experience. I think it will help them beyond this year as well.
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Post by fierce on Sept 4, 2020 10:42:43 GMT -5
I agree. But Tatum was not the reason we lost. The coach made the wrong call. Also, let's not forget Tatum is just 22 years old. It's not like he's a 30-year old veteran. it was a weird game. I thought toronto came to fight. We came to be friends. Hate that but thats what happened This I agree with. That's why I think this loss will make the Celts better from here on out. This loss is a reminder to the Celtic players that they have a long way to go. It's a wake up call for the Celtics.
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:44:03 GMT -5
Of course. Yes, we are putting too much on teh shoulders of a 22 year old. But if we want to win a championship - Tatum cant play like a 22 year old. Its not exactly fair to him, but if you want our championship window to start now (and not 2 years from now) Tatum needs to play beyond his years. I once hired a 23 year old, and I would consistently tell her "You are acting like a 23 year old!" And she would say "I am 23!" and I said, "no excuse". The reason the Celtics will win a championship is because they have multiple star players. Tatum is just one of them. This Celtics team doesn't rely on one player to win games. You want to get on Petey for changing positions - arent you the king of "Tatum is Batman, everyone else is Robin." And I argued with you for 2 years on that. Then, Tatum proves you right and me wrong. So I am willing to admit that we've had good , respectful debates on the subject. And Im happy to tell you were right, I was wrong. Tatum is batman. Props for seeing this before I did.
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Post by petey62 on Sept 4, 2020 10:45:56 GMT -5
Of course. Yes, we are putting too much on teh shoulders of a 22 year old. But if we want to win a championship - Tatum cant play like a 22 year old. Its not exactly fair to him, but if you want our championship window to start now (and not 2 years from now) Tatum needs to play beyond his years. I once hired a 23 year old, and I would consistently tell her "You are acting like a 23 year old!" And she would say "I am 23!" and I said, "no excuse". The reason the Celtics will win a championship is because they have multiple star players. Tatum is just one of them. This Celtics team doesn't rely on one player to win games. Fierce, very good points. But I just believe that each star player has a role to play and, when each star fulfills his role, the team benefits. The Celtics are a much better team when each star fulfills his role. The roles don't change from game to game, unless someone gets insanely hot like Smart did in the 4th quarter of game 2. Outside of that, each star has to play his role and last night, I don't think you can argue that Tatum DID NOT fulfill his role.
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Post by cole on Sept 4, 2020 10:51:48 GMT -5
Can lowry come back and play well again in 2 days? I'm hoping not
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:52:19 GMT -5
Look, if Petey was saying stuff like "Tatum has proven he cant be the man." or "Tatum cant be the best player on a championship team." Then I would agree, that Petey would be being overly harsh on a 22 year old.
But he's not saying that - he's talking about what it will take to finish off Toronto and ultimately win a championship this year. And in the context of our chances of winning this year, Tatums age is irrelevant.
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Post by drewski6 on Sept 4, 2020 10:54:01 GMT -5
Can lowry come back and play well again in 2 days? I'm hoping not If he gets going, and i was brad, I might consider bringing in Romeo for a bit to see if that disrupts his rhythm. Romeo is longer, quick, and a good perimeter defender.
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