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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 8:33:12 GMT -5
Baynes has a good thing going on in Phoenix, but if he came back to us he'd have a chance to start. Really, baynes isn't much of a championship starting center either. To get a championship quality big, we may have to be willing to thin out at the wing a bit, and I don't think Hayward is going to bring what we need. Baynes is good enough to minimize the damage of opposing bigs like Embiid, Giannis, and Adebayo. Sure Baynes is no championship starting Center, but he's an upgrade over what we got right now!
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Post by hedleylamarr on Oct 9, 2020 8:39:09 GMT -5
stats.nba.com/vs/#!?PlayerID=203382&VsPlayerID=1628464&Season=2019-20&SeasonType=Regular%20Season
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Post by cole on Oct 9, 2020 8:40:04 GMT -5
Well, I actually think baynes is probably equal to theis, but has a different set of abilities. I still think if we had both theis would start most nights, probably.
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Post by hedleylamarr on Oct 9, 2020 8:40:48 GMT -5
If Theis is a backup, so is Baynes. I'd be okay with RWill starting next year, but the real problem is the bench
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Post by hedleylamarr on Oct 9, 2020 8:42:38 GMT -5
stats.nba.com/vs/#!?PlayerID=1626167&VsPlayerID=1628464&Season=2019-20&SeasonType=Regular%20Season
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Post by hedleylamarr on Oct 9, 2020 8:43:39 GMT -5
Turner 18 mill
Thies 5 mill
Turner is better, yes..............but FOR THE MONEY??? Again, fix the bench first
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:01:56 GMT -5
Turner 18 mill Thies 5 mill Turner is better, yes..............but FOR THE MONEY??? Again, fix the bench first Celts are not getting Turner if Hayward or Smart is not part of a trade package. I agree that the bench needs fixing, but the team has to be fundamentally sound first. If you don't have a big that can help contain the elite bigs of the NBA, the Celts will just exit the playoffs again. The Lakers gave away 7 picks for AD? Look at the Lakers now. The Clips had one of the best benches in the NBA and did the Clips reach the west finals? Zubac vs. Jokic? I think we all know who's going to win that matchup. Fundamentals first then the bench. We already saw the result of Theis as the starting Center for one whole season. It will always be an uphill battle if the opposing bigs keeps getting 20 or more points on the Celts. Upgrading the bench and allowing the opposing bigs to dominate the Celts is like taking one step forward and two steps back.
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:10:23 GMT -5
We need to learn from the Lakers.
The pattern is very clear.
When it was Kobe and Kwame Brown, the Lakers missed the playoffs.
Lebron and McGee, Lakers also missed the playoffs.
When the Lakers got Pau Gasol, the Lakers won back to back championships.
Just last summer the Lakers got AD and Lebron is going to win a championship with the Lakers.
Celts also won when Ainge got KG.
The formula for winning a championship is very obvious.
If you have an elite big man, you're championship material, regardless of who's coaching.
Celts never reached the Finals with the likes of Tony Battie and Daniel Theis.
Only way is the Celts get that big man to help out Tatum and Brown.
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Post by elvissurfs on Oct 9, 2020 9:12:47 GMT -5
Should have got Doc back as coach...he would play RWill and Tacko...
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:19:59 GMT -5
Should have got Doc back as coach...he would play RWill and Tacko... Doc twice led 3-1 in the semis, in 2015 and in 2020, both times Doc ended up losing. That's why Doc got fired. So I don't believe Doc is better than Brad.
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Post by cole on Oct 9, 2020 9:25:16 GMT -5
Should have got Doc back as coach...he would play RWill and Tacko... Doc twice led 3-1 in the semis, in 2015 and in 2020, both times Doc ended up losing. That's why Doc got fired. So I don't believe Doc is better than Brad. But once he won
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:26:32 GMT -5
The coach is NOT the problem.
Give Brad a big man like Myles Turner or just someone better than Theis and if Brad still can't get to the Finals then the problem is Brad.
But until Ainge gives Brad a complete team, it's too early to talk about replacing the coach.
The Celts reached the east finals in 3 of the last 4 years.
Think about it, Lebron had a different coach every time he reached the Finals with a different team.
A few years ago it was Spo beating Vogel's Pacers in the east.
Now it's Vogel beating Spo in the Finals.
The only difference is which side Lebron is on.
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:28:07 GMT -5
Doc twice led 3-1 in the semis, in 2015 and in 2020, both times Doc ended up losing. That's why Doc got fired. So I don't believe Doc is better than Brad. But once he won Doc had KG when Doc won a championship. The best Center Brad had was Horford and Horford is really not a Center. Horford was also on the decline when the Celts got him.
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 9:50:16 GMT -5
Baynes has a good thing going on in Phoenix, but if he came back to us he'd have a chance to start. Really, baynes isn't much of a championship starting center either. To get a championship quality big, we may have to be willing to thin out at the wing a bit, and I don't think Hayward is going to bring what we need. I dont think Baynes is an upgrade from Theis, personally. Baynes doesnt run or pass as well, and I dont think he's mobile/athletic enough to guard people like Giannis/Bam. I think Turner is a better fit.
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:53:07 GMT -5
Baynes has a good thing going on in Phoenix, but if he came back to us he'd have a chance to start. Really, baynes isn't much of a championship starting center either. To get a championship quality big, we may have to be willing to thin out at the wing a bit, and I don't think Hayward is going to bring what we need. I dont think Baynes is an upgrade from Theis, personally. Baynes doesnt run or pass as well, and I dont think he's mobile/athletic enough to guard people like Giannis/Bam. I think Turner is a better fit. But if Baynes is available for the MLE then it will be worth it. Only way Ainge is going to get a guy like Myles Turner is if he trades Smart or Hayward. There's just no room for a big trade if Ainge doesn't trade Hayward or Smart.
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 9:56:08 GMT -5
Doc had KG when Doc won a championship. The best Center Brad had was Horford and Horford is really not a Center. Horford was also on the decline when the Celts got him. I disagree. When we had that year in 2017 - Al played out of his mind and was a great C. Problem was Tatum and Brown, in 2017, arent the players they are today. If you had 2017 Al this last postseason, we would have been very very dangerous.
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 9:59:23 GMT -5
Doc had KG when Doc won a championship. The best Center Brad had was Horford and Horford is really not a Center. Horford was also on the decline when the Celts got him. I disagree. When we had that year in 2017 - Al played out of his mind and was a great C. Problem was Tatum and Brown, in 2017, arent the players they are today. If you had 2017 Al this last postseason, we would have been very very dangerous. I didn't say he was bad. 14.0 ppg and 6.8 rpg is really not great for someone being paid 28m per year. When your best big man is only averaging 6.8 rpg, that's nowhere near great!
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 10:03:13 GMT -5
I dont think Baynes is an upgrade from Theis, personally. Baynes doesnt run or pass as well, and I dont think he's mobile/athletic enough to guard people like Giannis/Bam. I think Turner is a better fit. But if Baynes is available for the MLE then it will be worth it. Only way Ainge is going to get a guy like Myles Turner is if he trades Smart or Hayward. There's just no room for a big trade if Ainge doesn't trade Hayward or Smart. I could be interested in Baynes for MLE, if we made the following trade: Hayward + Theis for PG13 and Marcus Morris (sign and trade). PG 13 may be a good buy low option. Everyone is acting like he was this massive disappointment for LAC, but he shot like .410 from 3 last year, and still possesses a rare combination of size and speed. He'd also go along way to resolving size issues you point out, as he's a 6'8 shooting guard. With him, Brown, and Tatum as your 2,3,4 - thats an elite defense to cover wings. Plus its a 6'7 guy, 6'8 guy and 6'9 guy. Morris would help rebuild the bench, unless he wins the starting C role. Let Morris/Baynes/RWill fight it out for starting C.
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 10:06:43 GMT -5
I disagree. When we had that year in 2017 - Al played out of his mind and was a great C. Problem was Tatum and Brown, in 2017, arent the players they are today. If you had 2017 Al this last postseason, we would have been very very dangerous. I didn't say he was bad. 14.0 ppg and 6.8 rpg is really not great for someone being paid 28m per year. When your best big man is only averaging 6.8 rpg, that's nowhere near great! His efficiency and passing was crazy during that unexpected 2017 playoff run. He was our MVP and we beat some good teams and got pretty far. But I guess, I agree that his low rebounding total shows that he was already showing signs of athletic decline.
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 10:08:40 GMT -5
And he (Horford) was always kind of flat-footed when it comes to hops.
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Post by fierce on Oct 9, 2020 10:14:20 GMT -5
But if Baynes is available for the MLE then it will be worth it. Only way Ainge is going to get a guy like Myles Turner is if he trades Smart or Hayward. There's just no room for a big trade if Ainge doesn't trade Hayward or Smart. I could be interested in Baynes for MLE, if we made the following trade: Hayward + Theis for PG13 and Marcus Morris (sign and trade). PG 13 may be a good buy low option. Everyone is acting like he was this massive disappointment for LAC, but he shot like .410 from 3 last year, and still possesses a rare combination of size and speed. He'd also go along way to resolving size issues you point out, as he's a 6'8 shooting guard. With him, Brown, and Tatum as your 2,3,4 - thats an elite defense to cover wings. Plus its a 6'7 guy, 6'8 guy and 6'9 guy. Morris would help rebuild the bench, unless he wins the starting C role. Let Morris/Baynes/RWill fight it out for starting C. I don't know if Morris wants back with the Celts after how Ainge treated him. Morris was upset at how the Celts handled his free-agency. I don't know about PG13, I prefer a healthy Hayward than PG13.
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 10:26:51 GMT -5
Here's what I would do 1) Trade Hayward and Theis and our second first round pick for PG13 and Morris. 2) On draft night, call up Ind and ask who they want at pick 14 (you want to make the pick and then trade the player, rather than trading the pick because then it counts for salary match) 3) Grab whomever Ind selects, trade that player + Langford + Kanter + Poirier for Myles Turner 4) Use MLE to bring back Wannamaker 5) Package next year's pick + our third first round pick to move some spots and grab the best shooter available (hopefully saddiq bey).
Kemba PG13 JB Tatum Turner
Bench guards: Wannamaker Smart Bey forwards: Morris GWill Semi Centers: RWill Tacko
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Post by drewski6 on Oct 9, 2020 10:32:40 GMT -5
I could be interested in Baynes for MLE, if we made the following trade: Hayward + Theis for PG13 and Marcus Morris (sign and trade). PG 13 may be a good buy low option. Everyone is acting like he was this massive disappointment for LAC, but he shot like .410 from 3 last year, and still possesses a rare combination of size and speed. He'd also go along way to resolving size issues you point out, as he's a 6'8 shooting guard. With him, Brown, and Tatum as your 2,3,4 - thats an elite defense to cover wings. Plus its a 6'7 guy, 6'8 guy and 6'9 guy. Morris would help rebuild the bench, unless he wins the starting C role. Let Morris/Baynes/RWill fight it out for starting C. I don't know if Morris wants back with the Celts after how Ainge treated him. Morris was upset at how the Celts handled his free-agency. I don't know about PG13, I prefer a healthy Hayward than PG13. Hayward is a career: .366 shooter from 3, PG 13: career .380 from 3. Hayward is 6'7 wit ha 6'8 wingspan; PG13 is 6'8 with a 6'11 wingspan Their career apg is practically identical PG13 is a much better defender Hayward career RPG: 4.4; PG13: 6.4
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2020 10:41:16 GMT -5
Here's what I would do 1) Trade Hayward and Theis and our second first round pick for PG13 and Morris. 2) On draft night, call up Ind and ask who they want at pick 14 (you want to make the pick and then trade the player, rather than trading the pick because then it counts for salary match) 3) Grab whomever Ind selects, trade that player + Langford + Kanter + Poirier for Myles Turner 4) Use MLE to bring back Wannamaker 5) Package next year's pick + our third first round pick to move some spots and grab the best shooter available (hopefully saddiq bey). Kemba PG13 JB Tatum Turner Bench guards: Wannamaker Smart Bey forwards: Morris GWill Semi Centers: RWill Tacko Our biggest mistake last year was to give Walker 30+ mil. Unless we can trade him were going nowhere three more years of overpaying an average player. He's not close to a top tier.. Turner likely isn't coming to Boston GWS and a couple other teams has much better to offer. Fierce is right Morris wasn't a happy camper his last year here....
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Post by hedleylamarr on Oct 9, 2020 10:41:25 GMT -5
AD was too expensive for a one year rental. Danny wants to be good for a long time, not just for one year. I'm not sure I would be happy if we traded for AD. It's true, they don't grow on trees, but I want a guy who will be here and help us be good for many years
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